Interview with Thuingaleng Muivah
Mizzima News (www.mizzima.com)
July 23, 2007 - Nagas, an ethnic minority living both in India's northeast and Burma's northwest, have waged one of the longest insurgencies in South Asia, demanding an independent state. Led by an armed rebel group, the National Socialist Council of Nagalim, under the leadership of Isak Chisi Swu and Thuingaleng Muivah, the Nagas are carrying on an unending struggle to fulfill their aspiration to unite Naga inhabitants both in India and Burma and live independently.
However, with increasing bilateral cooperation between India and the Burmese military junta, the NSCN (I-M) led movement seems to be at the cross roads.
In August, the decade long ceasefire between the government of India (GOI) and the NSCN (I-M) will end. And there is widespread speculation on the prospects of the Naga movement as a whole.
Mizzima's desk writer, Lemyao Shimray, caught up with Thuingaleng Muivah, the general secretary of NSCN (I-M), during a fleeting visit to New Delhi, and interviewed him on the prospects of the Naga movement both in India and in Burma.
Mizzima: Sir, we are aware that the ceasefire agreement between NSCN and India is expiring soon. Is there any possibility of extending it? What is the prospect of a further ceasefire?
Muivah: We have talked a lot about it. But as you know it is our political commitment to our people that whenever there is an extension of ceasefire or the issue becomes serious, we will come back and ask the people because we are responsible to the people. So, we have fixed a meeting for the 27th. There we will decide. There, we will discuss about the last talks we had here. Yes I think it is quite possible.
Mizzima: Where will the next talks be held? Here in New Delhi, outside India or has the place been already decided in your last meeting?
Muivah: We have asked them (GOI) this time to come to Nagaland and talk there.
Mizzima: Through 10 years of the cease fire, do you think India has been true to its commitment? And what has been the impact on the Naga movement as a whole?
Muivah: Yes, it is a big question. Anyway this is very pertinent. You know we have explained our position clearly enough and they cannot deny it. After all they are clear enough about the nature of the Naga issue. Now it is for them to decide. If they cannot take positives steps, then we have to say that they neither have the guts nor the sincerity to solve the problem.
Mizzima: What kind of sincerity are we talking about? Because the Indian Government has mentioned that Nagas have to agree to abide by the country's constitution, so what are your views about the Indian Constitution?
Muivah: We are not interested in talking about the Constitution because we know one of the principles of the talks is that it has to be unconditional. There should be no precondition on either side. So, we will stick to that.
Mizzima: When you say Naga movement, it includes Eastern Nagaland, which is currently under Burmese military rule. What is the level of struggle or movement in Eastern Nagaland?
Muivah: The first point is that everyone needs to know that Nagaland has been divided not by the Nagas themselves but by external forces. So, Nagas have every right to start the movement and fight the external combination. It is not an acceptation for the Nagas. Yes, as long as our people living on that side are responsible to us and we will be equally responsible to them to decide our fate together.
Mizzima: Sir, the NSCN has said that the Burmese military junta is trying to divide the Nagas. So what are the steps that have been taken to counter this if there is such a plan at all?
Muivah: It is not a surprise that the Burmese junta will do whatever they like. They are aware that Nagas are a force and have their own national movement. It would naturally affect them. So, how to counter it? Yes, they are in the process of dividing the Nagas further. But the question is that in the 21st century it is not for the Burmese to decide the fate of the Nagas neither is it for the Indians to decide the fate of the Nagas, but, the Nagas themselves. We have to decide. And until that is done of course there will be problems.
Mizzima: Sir, if Daw Aung San Suu Kyi comes to power or the military junta is overthrown, do you think it will be possible for Nagas in Burma to be more flexible and would they have more freedom?
Muivah: At the moment we think, Aung San Suu Kyi will be more understanding. We believe she respects people's voice because she herself is a lover of democracy. I think it is not on our part to have that kind of expectation from her though.
Mizzima: The Indian government has asked the junta to flush out Indian insurgents from Burmese soil. Do you feel that this would pose a threat to the Naga movement spearheaded by the NSCN?
Muivah: If I am to say at all, their collaboration is against the NSCN as a whole. Because they both know that NSCN is a force to reckon with. Yes, in that area, in the East we were there as also in the west and we can prove it. So, naturally they will be forced to collaborate with each other against us, mainly against the NSCN. They will do that and it is not a surprise but how far they will succeed that is a different question. The future will say. The Indians and the Burmese will be compelled to do that because they cannot ignore the force shaping up. So, you know they have to be alert, very much so otherwise the field will be left to the opponent alone. And in our case also, yes, we need them because what is ours is ours. But so far you know, we have been maintaining a ceasefire -- not fighting the Burmese.
Mizzima: What about Burma's military junta? Are the Nagas planning to have a ceasefire with them? Or is there to be any negotiation with the junta?
Muivah: At the moment we don't have it. But feel that it is not necessary to solve the problem through fighting. If they can understand us, in the near future we can start negotiations.
Mizzima: Has there been any talks earlier about the issue with the junta?
Muivah: No. Of course there were some interactions but that was not very meaningful. But remember we haven't clashed with them for a pretty long time and I think they understand that.
Mizzima: What about the NSCN –K, [Khaplang]. Is the Burmese Army after them?
Muivah: The NSCN-K, of course they have been chasing them. Well, they have to be that way. There is no other alternative. How much they can do, we do not know but Burmese armed forces must be moving up and down. They have to deal with them and if we happen to be there, they will be bound to deal with us also. But that will not bring a solution. There must be an attempt or efforts to come to an understanding peacefully like making contacts or something of the kind.
Mizzima: Sir, one last question. What is the NSCN's vision for the future and what do you envision about Eastern Nagaland?
Muivah: Our vision is very clear. The Nagas are the people who can develop themselves best. Nagas are the people that we have to trust most. Other people cannot think what is good for us and we cannot expect the best for us from them. This is our political philosophy. So, until that is achieved, you know you cannot expect the best and our life here on earth will be all together pitiful. But we know for sure that the Nagas will have their own rights. Nagas will have their own rights meaning, Nagas will have the right to determine their own fate and Nagas can do the best for themselves. We believe in that. So long as that kind of philosophy is there of course Nagas can have a future. There is no doubt about it.
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